RE: University Degree or CISSP

["evb" <swiver () cox net>]

College is intended to teach people how to think and communicate, both
verbally in writing.  The CISSP is not.  To bring Bill Gates into this I
think is to steer a bit of course.  

Further, the question was presented as an either/or question, so the answer
of "both" doesn't count.

Eric
www.risk-averse.com

:-----Original Message-----
:From: Toby Barrick [mailto:tbarrick () cox net] 
:Sent: Tuesday, January 24, 2006 2:52 PM
:To: Ken Kousky; security-basics () securityfocus com
:Subject: Re: University Degree or CISSP
:
:Ken,
:
:With you as a degree holder (I assume that you are) I'm sure 
:that you feel that way about a degree. The fact of the matter 
:is that a degree is a piece of paper, a mark on a stick as to 
:what you have spent in dollars and time. A CISSP is a mark on 
:a stick as to what you know (memorized) about security related 
:issues (plus whatever money was spent). Neither of which, in 
:the real word is worth it's weight in paper.
:
:I know lots of folks that have PhD that are worthless. Yeah 
:they bang down the bucks due to the paper on the wall, but 
:they are totally clueless. I know mechanics that make more 
:than I do investing in futures.
:
:I'm not a big fan of the guy but take Bill Gates for example. 
:He does not have a degree, he dropped out of college. I'd 
:actually be surprised if he even has any certifications.
:
:The bottom line counts in this world is vision, insight, 
:intuition, hard work, and a feel for situations that whisper 
:"this is not right," I can fix it - then acting on that thought.
:
:Ok - I'm sure the flames will fly in my face, but that is my opinion.
:
:Have a great day.
:
:
:Ken Kousky wrote:
:
:> This is the craziest conversation I ever heard of - there is NO 
:> comparison between a REAL degree and CISSP. CISSP is great, valuable 
:> and vital but it isn't in any way comparable.
:> 
:> Simply put, if you don't have a degree - get one and get the 
:best one 
:> you can.
:> 
:> -----Original Message-----
:> From: Huang, John, GCM [mailto:John.Huang () rbsgc com]
:> Sent: Monday, January 23, 2006 1:41 PM
:> To: security-basics () securityfocus com
:> Subject: RE: Re: University Degree or CISSP
:> 
:> Degree or CISSP? It depends on where you are in life. A degree helps 
:> you in the door and advancement into a management position usually 
:> require a college degree. But if you're already in the field 
:and don't 
:> have a college degree, a CISSP cert is easier to obtain in a shorter 
:> amount of time, and provide more immediate benefit since you can put 
:> the things you learn into use.
:> 
:> -----Original Message-----
:> From: shyaam () gmail com [mailto:shyaam () gmail com]
:> Sent: Friday, January 20, 2006 10:25 PM
:> To: security-basics () securityfocus com
:> Subject: Re: Re: University Degree or CISSP
:> 
:> Yes,
:> Very true. Nothing counts equivalent to experience, but experience 
:> comes only when someone starts somewhere. I have seen one big thing 
:> happening around. People in the industries shifted from 
:technology to 
:> business, that is the point when they lost the security and created 
:> more loopholes in their own products as they reduced the 
:time needed, 
:> reduced budgets and spent more on advertisements and marketing.
:> How does that reflect on people. They need people already with 
:> experience. But how is that possible. Everybody needs to start 
:> somewhere. So experience does count, but I would say some 
:foundation, 
:> some added qualification and some experience is good for a cool job. 
:> For a startup job, some degree and some cert is essential.
:> 
:> PS: This is my opinion, I am not pointing out any company or any 
:> private organization.
:> 
:> -S-
:> 
:> 
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:> ----- EARN A MASTER OF SCIENCE IN INFORMATION ASSURANCE - ONLINE The 
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:> education and the case study affords you unmatched 
:consulting experience.
:> Tailor your education to your own professional goals with degree 
:> customizations including Emergency Management, Business Continuity 
:> Planning,
:> 
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:----------------------------------------------------------------------
:> ----- EARN A MASTER OF SCIENCE IN INFORMATION ASSURANCE - ONLINE The 
:> Norwich University program offers unparalleled Infosec management 
:> education and the case study affords you unmatched 
:consulting experience.
:> Tailor your education to your own professional goals with degree 
:> customizations including Emergency Management, Business Continuity 
:> Planning, Computer Emergency Response Teams, and Digital 
:Investigations.
:> 
:> http://www.msia.norwich.edu/secfocus
:> 
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:> 
:> 
:
:
:
:---------------------------------------------------------------
:------------
:EARN A MASTER OF SCIENCE IN INFORMATION ASSURANCE - ONLINE The 
:Norwich University program offers unparalleled Infosec 
:management education and the case study affords you unmatched 
:consulting experience. 
:Tailor your education to your own professional goals with 
:degree customizations including Emergency Management, Business 
:Continuity Planning, Computer Emergency Response Teams, and 
:Digital Investigations. 
:
:http://www.msia.norwich.edu/secfocus
:---------------------------------------------------------------
:------------
:


---------------------------------------------------------------------------
EARN A MASTER OF SCIENCE IN INFORMATION ASSURANCE - ONLINE
The Norwich University program offers unparalleled Infosec management 
education and the case study affords you unmatched consulting experience. 
Tailor your education to your own professional goals with degree 
customizations including Emergency Management, Business Continuity Planning, 
Computer Emergency Response Teams, and Digital Investigations. 

http://www.msia.norwich.edu/secfocus
---------------------------------------------------------------------------