Security Basics mailing list archives
RE: A doable frequent password change policy?
From: "Craig Wright" <Craig.Wright () bdo com au>
Date: Sun, 1 Jul 2007 07:22:33 +1000
Hi There are 3 aspects to password chaning: 1 Crack of the password and the length it is valid over a network use case. 2 Capture and crack of the password database offline 3 Leakage of the password through other means - eg brute force grinding of the admin password over Terminal services open tro the Internet. These are a function of the controls. First to address issues 1 and 2. These require a capture of a secret. Issue 1 is easy to capture, but limited in what should be captured. Issue 2 is difficult to do (or should be so) but gives a large amount of information. There are other more effective controls over authentication for issues 1 and 2 than enforced password changes. The use of IPSec for instance (issue 1) or the monitoring and lockdown of the authentication server (issue 2). Issue 3 is generally the one people are most worried about. However, this is the issue that is the least likely to be addressed from a password change regime. Mathematically, the likelihood function derived from a password change being effective in stopping an attacker guessing the password subsequent to the change is related to the strength of the new password relative to the old and not the frequency of change. The frequency of change is insignificant even at the alpha = 1% level and may be ignored. In fact, the issues with users having to remember passwords and the resultant issue of having them write them etc is actually of larger effect mathematically and more than negates the benifit of password changing with issue 3 What we are left with is the function of the likelihood of a password being guessed from the old password weighted against the same likelihood on the new password. So there is thus no chance in likelihood of compromise for an "equal" password, less for a simpler (mathematically) one and a larger likelihood for a more complex one. This is possible to model mathematically, but due to the complexity of issues 1 and 2 and the number of network controls, computationally difficult. It is not as if it is in the NP hard range though. I have started working on a Bayesian model which can take a large variety of controls to model all three issues and derive the optimum password change time. I do not expect to have this finished before this time next year though. What matters most is the strength of the password and controls to prevent access to it, not the age. The reason to change passwords is based on an incomplete understanding of our systems (which is understandable due to complexity), the incompleteness of controls over the passwords and the threat of passwords having been compromised already and thus limiting the time that this threat can act as an exposure. Regards, Craig Craig Wright Manager of Information Systems Direct : +61 2 9286 5497 Craig.Wright () bdo com au +61 417 683 914 BDO Kendalls (NSW) Level 19, 2 Market Street Sydney NSW 2000 GPO BOX 2551 Sydney NSW 2001 Fax +61 2 9993 9497 www.bdo.com.au Liability limited by a scheme approved under Professional Standards Legislation in respect of matters arising within those States and Territories of Australia where such legislation exists. The information in this email and any attachments is confidential. If you are not the named addressee you must not read, print, copy, distribute, or use in any way this transmission or any information it contains. If you have received this message in error, please notify the sender by return email, destroy all copies and delete it from your system. Any views expressed in this message are those of the individual sender and not necessarily endorsed by BDO Kendalls. You may not rely on this message as advice unless subsequently confirmed by fax or letter signed by a Partner or Director of BDO Kendalls. It is your responsibility to scan this communication and any files attached for computer viruses and other defects. BDO Kendalls does not accept liability for any loss or damage however caused which may result from this communication or any files attached. A full version of the BDO Kendalls disclaimer, and our Privacy statement, can be found on the BDO Kendalls website at http://www.bdo.com.au or by emailing administrator () bdo com au. BDO Kendalls is a national association of separate partnerships and entities. ________________________________ From: listbounce () securityfocus com on behalf of WALI Sent: Fri 29/06/2007 3:20 PM To: security-basics () securityfocus com Subject: A doable frequent password change policy? Yes I am aware of the importance of advising users on changing their passwords frequently, be it their AD passwords or passwords on other independent applications (ERP) etc. But I don't want to enforce a policy that comes crashing down. I personally, cannot keep changing my password every month making sure that it differs from the last two in history (at least). Even Cisco on it's CCO account only makes it's users aware that their password hasn't been changed for quite some time and giving them an option of either changing it or just do a 'No Thanks' option and carry on with their old password. This sounds like a doable compliance to me. Your thoughts??
Current thread:
- RE: A doable frequent password change policy? Craig Wright (Jul 02)
- <Possible follow-ups>
- Re: A doable frequent password change policy? krymson (Jul 03)
- Re: A doable frequent password change policy? gjgowey (Jul 04)
- RE: A doable frequent password change policy? Largacha Lamela, Daniel (Jul 05)
- Re: A doable frequent password change policy? gjgowey (Jul 04)
- Re: A doable frequent password change policy? mpalmer (Jul 06)