on Flag Burning interesting history djf

[David Farber <dave () farber net>]

Begin forwarded message:

From:
Date: June 28, 2006 5:44:09 PM EDT
To: dave () farber net
Subject: Re: [IP] more on Orrin Hatch/Andrew Tobias on Flag Burning

Dave,
Please render this anonymous.  I know personally that Hatch is a  
vindictive SoB.
======================
Senator Orrin Hatch (R-Utah) today on NPR was opining that yes  
indeed,  passing a don't-burn-the-flag constitutional amendment *is*  
the most  important thing for the U.S. Senate to do right now.   In  
terms of Rove-Republican strategy this was, like the “anti-Gay  
Marriage” amendment, nothing but political grandstanding that was  
intended to fail with the intent of tarring those who voted no in  
anticipation of the November election.
For Hatch, however, it was more.  The senior Mormon senator from Utah  
proved himself in New Testament terms to be the most complete  
hypocrite: “Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites!, because  
ye build the tombs of the prophets and garnish the sepulchres of the  
righteous, And say, If we had been in the days of our fathers, we  
would not have been partakers with them in the blood of the  
prophets.” (Matthew 23:29-30) Consider the following orthodox Mormon  
record and perspective on Mormons using the flag for symbolic  
protest, and how power-seeking anti-Mormon politicians and veterans’  
lobbies used that as a pretext to send troops against the Mormon  
people.  Hatch’s venom against those who use the flag for political  
statements proves, in New Testament terms, that he would have  
murdered his own Mormon ancestors.

B. H. Roberts, A Comprehensive History of the [L.D.S.] Church, Volume  
Six, p. 159-162
                    HALF MASTING OF THE FLAG INCIDENT
   On the 4th of July, 1885, an unfortunate circumstance occurred in  
the half masting of the national flag, at the City Hall by some of  
the city's officers, and by other parties at the Salt Lake county  
courthouse; also at the Salt Lake Theater, Z. C. M. I. Building,  
Deseret News Office, Church Tithing Office, the Gardo House—the  
residence at the time of President John Taylor; at the temple, and  
the tabernacle. There was of course no intention in any way to  
dishonor the flag. Placed at half mast it is an emblem of mourning;  
and as the community was then terrorized by a cruel mal- 
administration of the law against the Latter-day Saints, as  
subsequent reversals and condemnations of the procedure by the  
supreme court of the United States and the dismissal of federal  
officers by the national administration attest—it was evidently a  
time of mourning for the Latter-day Saints in Salt Lake City, who  
constituted the majority of her people; and the city officers thought  
themselves justified in thus expressing that sorrow. Such the  
explanation of the city marshal, Mr. Wm. G. Philips—"half masting of  
the flag expressed the feelings of the majority of the citizens."
   As soon as the half masting of the flag became known among the  
non-"Mormon" part of the citizens great indignation and excitement  
arose, and angry crowds gathered at the City Hall and at the Z. C. M.  
I. store where for a time riot threatened. A committee of citizens  
consisting of United States Marshal Ireland, Major Wilkes,—who was an  
ex-confederate soldier—Captain Evans, and C. L. Haines, went to the  
City Hall and demanded to know the reason for the flag being at half  
mast. Nobody knew except that Marshal Philips had ordered it to be so  
placed. The mayor and marshal, being in attendance at a meeting at  
the Salt Lake "Mormon" tabernacle, were sent for, and on arriving at  
the City Hall the marshal took full responsibility for the half  
masting. After consultation had with the committee the flag was taken  
down, but later in the day it was raised to the head of the staff by  
order of the mayor, Hon. James Sharp. A request by the offended  
citizens was sufficient to cause Sheriff Groesbeck, at the county  
courthouse, to order the flag raised to full mast. The flag at the  
Salt Lake Theater was raised to full mast early in the day, so too  
was the flag at Z. C. M. I. At the other places enumerated above it  
remained at half mast throughout the day.
   When word of the event was brought to the G. A. R. encampment  
being held that day in the suburbs of the city, fiery speeches were  
made, equally warm resolutions passed demanding that the flag be  
raised to full mast. It was claimed that the governor had telephoned  
to General McCook for military assistance, but that the general  
refused to interfere, judging that there was no necessity for such  
action.  So the incident closed except for some inconsequential mass  
meetings that followed. One held at the Methodist church, at which  
Governor Murray spoke; and one held by the general public in the  
federal court room.
   It was thought that a conflict over the question of half masting  
the flag would come up again on the twenty-fourth of July, as that  
was Utah's Pioneer Day, and it was the custom to celebrate the day— 
would it be done by half masting the flag?
   Such representations were made to the press of the east that the  
question of "Mormon" loyalty was very generally discussed. From Salt  
Lake City appeals were made to members of the G. A. R. to ex- 
confederate soldiers, and to men in the mining camps to come to Salt  
Lake City on the 24th of July to prevent what was alleged would be an  
intended insult to the flag by half masting it on that occasion.
   "The ex-confederate soldiers," said the local announcement in the  
Salt Lake Tribune of this meeting, "are talking of holding an  
indignation meeting here on the 24th inst., to express their views on  
the insult offered to the flag on July 4th by the Mormon church in  
this city."
   "The federal court room has been obtained, the railroads have  
agreed to give half-fare rates from Park City, Ogden and the mining  
camps, and the hotels such reasonable rates as to make it an object.  
The sentiments of the ex-confederates are to be embodied in the form  
of resolutions to be sent to the southern states and congressmen,  
politicians and newspapers in that section * * * It is a good move,  
and for another reason. There is talk on the streets to the effect  
that on the 24th—'Pioneer's Day'—the Mormons intend to drape the flag  
in mourning and float it at half mast. That would be a good day for  
the presence in this city of two or three thousand old soldiers,  
federal and confederate. It would probably result in a speedy and  
effectual settlement of the whole Mormon business, for with such men  
here in force the nation's flag would not be insulted with impunity."
   Such representations were made to President Cleveland as to the  
prospect of a riot in Salt Lake City that he gave orders on the 17th  
of July to General O. O. Howard, in military command of the west, to  
station divisions of the army along railroad lines at points from  
which they could readily be rushed into Salt Lake City in case they  
should be needed. The Lincoln Post G. A. R., Butte, Montana, on the  
18th of July, on the strength of reports from General Howard and  
"information from comrades of the G. A. R., resident in Salt Lake  
City," made tender of service to Governor Murray of two companies "A"  
and "B" of that post, numbering "eighty strong," "armed, uniformed  
and equipped," and "every man of them a veteran."
                   THE WHOLE NATION HALF-MASTED THE FLAG ON JULY  
24TH, 1885
   On the part of the Latter-day Saints the most formidable function  
planned for that day in Salt Lake City was the meeting of a mammoth  
Sunday School convention in the tabernacle. Things looked ominous;  
but strangely enough the United States flag throughout the United  
States, as also in Utah, was at half mast that 24th day of July,  
1885; for ex-president of the United States, and national hero, U. S.  
Grant, at Mt. McGregor, New York, after a lingering illness, died at  
8:08 on the morning of the 23rd of July. Everywhere throughout the  
nation the flag was placed at half mast; and the threatened crisis in  
Utah passed without a conflict.

=======================

And this morning Sen. Orin Hatch was on NPR opining that yes indeed,   
passing a don't-burn-the-flag constitutional amendment *is* the most   
important thing for the senate to do right now.

> David Farber wrote:
>
> > Begin forwarded message:
> >
> > From: Ralph <rs () his com>
> > Date: June 28, 2006 6:46:50 AM EDT
> > To: Dave Farber <dave () farber net>
> > Subject: Andrew Tobias on Flag Burning
> >
> > http://www.andrewtobias.com/newcolumns/060628.html
> >
> > Flag Burning
> > Published on June 28, 2006
> >
> > Oh, for crying out loud.
> >
> > The whole point of America is that you can burn the flag.   
> > Nothing  sums up her greatness so succinctly.  And it is precisely  
> > this –  that in America you should be free to do any damn thing  
> > you please  so long as it does not impinge on the rights of others  
> > – that leads  most of us to abhor the idea of burning it in the  
> > first place.
> >
> > And one thing you should absolutely be free to do in America is   
> > criticize your country and express outrage at its behavior – even   
> > if you’re wrong.  We call that the Bill of Rights.



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