Interesting People mailing list archives

] Ok guys and girls -- just who is telling the truth.

From: David Farber <dave () farber net>
Date: Sat, 24 May 2008 16:40:16 -0400




Begin forwarded message:

From: Lauren Weinstein <lauren () vortex com>
Date: May 24, 2008 4:29:50 PM EDT
To: David Farber <dave () farber net>
Cc: "lauren () vortex com" <lauren () vortex com>
Subject: Re: [IP] Ok guys and girls -- just who is telling the truth.

Dave,

One might note that the mere concurrence of BitTorrent, Inc., who
has their own business model to protect, doesn't change a protocol
violation into an acceptable technique, even when used on an interim
basis (e.g. from Comcast's standpoint, "until we got caught and
found ourselves under the FCC gun on this matter ...")

Nor does BitTorrent, Inc. necessarily speak for many other than
themselves on this topic, especially not the larger universe of
Internet users who wish to communicate on the Net without having
their unencrypted data content probed, monitored, altered, injected,
wiretapped, modified, and otherwise screwed with by some "pushing the
envelope until it rips" ISPs.

Of course, in the longer run encryption is likely to render much
of this moot -- the sooner the better.

--Lauren--
Lauren Weinstein
lauren () vortex com or lauren () pfir org
Tel: +1 (818) 225-2800
http://www.pfir.org/lauren
Co-Founder, PFIR
 - People For Internet Responsibility - http://www.pfir.org
Co-Founder, NNSquad
 - Network Neutrality Squad - http://www.nnsquad.org
Founder, PRIVACY Forum - http://www.vortex.com
Member, ACM Committee on Computers and Public Policy
Lauren's Blog: http://lauren.vortex.com

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Begin forwarded message:
From: Seth Finkelstein <sethf () sethf com>
Date: May 24, 2008 3:22:03 PM EDT
To: ip <ip () v2 listbox com>
Cc: David Farber <dave () farber net>, Brett Glass <brett () lariat net>
Subject: Re: [IP] Re: Ok guys and girls -- just who is telling
the truth.
[For IP, if worthy]
On Sat, May 24, 2008 at 06:43:44AM -0700, David Farber wrote:
Sorry for the misunderstanding of what Comcast said -- I heard STOP
not stop someday real soon djf (they need better communications)
 In the far future, so we are told, a system will be developed
where everyone will be a publisher, where they will be able to get
their
message out without gatekeepers. It'll be called the Intruthnot, or
something like that (and be full of Universal Resource Lie-caters).

 So, *without* *taking* *sides*, Comcast's actual statement is:

http://www.comcast.com/About/PressRelease/PressReleaseDetail.ashx?PRID=740
"Comcast and BitTorrent Form Collaboration to Address Network
Management, Network Architecture and Content Distribution"

 Of which the most relevant portion is:

"The Comcast and BitTorrent discussions have already produced
meaningful results. On the one hand, Comcast announced that it will
migrate by year-end 2008 to a capacity management technique that is
protocol agnostic. "This means that we will have to rapidly
reconfigure our network management systems, but the outcome will be
a traffic management technique that is more appropriate for today's
emerging Internet trends. We have been discussing this migration
and its effects with leaders in the Internet community for the last
several months, and we will refine, adjust, and publish the
technique based upon feedback and initial trial results," said Tony
Werner, Comcast Cable's Chief Technology Officer.

In turn, BitTorrent acknowledged the need of ISPs to manage their
networks, especially during times of peak congestion. "While we
think there were other management techniques that could have been
deployed, we understand why Comcast and other ISPs adopted the
approach that they did initially. Recognizing that the Web is
richer and more bandwidth intensive than it has been historically,
we are pleased that Comcast understands these changing traffic
patterns and wants to collaborate with us to migrate to techniques
that the Internet community will find to be more transparent," said
Eric Klinker, BitTorrent's Chief Technology Officer.

"Earlier this year, Comcast announced its plans for the aggressive
deployment of wideband Internet services using the DOCSIS 3.0
standard, which we project will be available in up to 20% of
Comcast's households by the end of this year," said John Schanz,
Comcast Cable's Executive Vice President of National Engineering and
Technical Operations. "Additionally, we plan to more than double
the upstream capacity of our residential Internet service in several
key markets by year end 2008. We plan to take advantage of
multi-carrier technology to further increase upstream capacity for
all of our broadband customers in advance of the full DOCSIS 3.0
roll out."


--
Seth Finkelstein Consulting Programmer http://sethf.com
Infothought blog - http://sethf.com/infothought/blog/
Interview: http://sethf.com/essays/major/greplaw-interview.php
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<html><body bgcolor=3D"#FFFFFF"><div> Begin forwardedmessage:<b=r> </div><blockquote type=3D"cite"><div>From: SethFinkelstein &l=t;<a href=3D"mailto:sethf () sethf com">sethf () sethf com</a>> Date:</b=
May 24, 2008 3:22:03 PM EDT To: ip <<a href=3D"mailto:ip@v2.=
listbox.com">ip () v2 listbox com</a>> Cc: David Farber<<a hr=ef=3D"mailto:dave () farber net">dave () farber net</a>>, Brett Glass<<a h=ref=3D"mailto:brett () lariat net">brett () lariat net</a>> Subject:=Re: [IP] Re:    Ok guys and girls -- just who istelling the =truth. </div></blockquote><div></div><blockquotetype=3D"cite"><=div>[For IP, if worthy] On Sat, May 24, 2008at 06:43=:44AM -0700, David Farber wrote: <blockquotetype=3D"cite">=Sorry for the misunderstanding of what Comcast said -- I heardSTOP<=br></blockquote><blockquote type=3D"cite">not stop somedayreal soon =djf (they need better communications) </blockquote><=br>        In the farfuture, so w=e are told, a system will be developed whereeveryone will =be a publisher, where they will be able to get their messag=e out without gatekeepers. It'll be called the Intruthnot, or <sp=an>something like that (and be full of Universal Resource Lie-caters).</spa=n>        So,=*without* *taking* *sides*, Comcast's actual statement is: <span=
 <a href=3D"http://www.comcast.com/About/PressRelease/Pres=
sReleaseDetail.ashx?PRID=3D740">http://www.comcast.com/About/PressRelease/P=
ressReleaseDetail.ashx?PRID=3D740</a> "Comcast andBitTorre=nt Form Collaboration to Address Network Management, Networ=k Architecture and Content Distribution" =       Of which the mostrelevant portio=n is: "The Comcast and BitTorrentdiscuss=ions have already produced  meaningfulresults. &nbsp=;On the one hand, Comcast announced that it will  mig=rate by year-end 2008 to a capacity management technique that is =  protocol agnostic.  "This means that we will haveto rapi=dly  reconfigure our network managementsystems, but =the outcome will be  a traffic managementtechnique t=hat is more appropriate for today's  emergingInterne=t trends.  We have been discussing this migration &nb=sp;and its effects with leaders in the Internet community for thelast</spa=n>  several months, and we will refine, adjust, andpublish =the  technique based upon feedback andinitial trial =results," said Tony  Werner, Comcast Cable'sChief Te=chnology Officer.  In turn,BitTorre=nt acknowledged the need of ISPs to manage their  net=works, especially during times of peak congestion.  "While we<b=r>  think there were other management techniques thatcould have=been  deployed, we understand why Comcast andother =ISPs adopted the  approach that they didinitially. &=nbsp;Recognizing that the Web is  richer andmore ban=dwidth intensive than it has been historically,  we a=re pleased that Comcast understands these changing traffic = patterns and wants to collaborate with us to migrate totechniques</=span>  that the Internet community will find to bemore tran=sparent," said  Eric Klinker, BitTorrent'sChief Tech=nology Officer.  "Earlierthis year,=Comcast announced its plans for the aggressive  depl=oyment of wideband Internet services using the DOCSIS 3.0 = standard, which we project will be available in up to 20% of<b=r>  Comcast's households by the end of this year," saidJohn Sch=anz,  Comcast Cable's Executive VicePresident of Nat=ional Engineering and  Technical Operations. "A=dditionally, we plan to more than double  theupstrea=m capacity of our residential Internet service in several = key markets by year end 2008.  We plan to take advantageof</spa=n>  multi-carrier technology to further increaseupstream ca=pacity for  all of our broadband customers inadvance=of the full DOCSIS 3.0  roll out." <=/span> -- SethFinkelstein  =Consulting Programmer  <a href=3D"http://sethf.com";><ahref=3D"http://=sethf.com">http://sethf.com</a></a> Infothoughtblog - <a h=
ref=3D"http://sethf.com/infothought/blog/";><a href=3D"http://sethf.com/info=
thought/blog/">http://sethf.com/infothought/blog/</a></a> I=nterview: <a href=3D"http://sethf.com/essays/major/greplaw-interview.php"><=a href=3D"http://sethf.com/essays/major/greplaw-interview.php";>http://sethf=.com/essays/major/greplaw-interview.php</a></a> =</div></blockquote><div style=3D"padding:0 4px 4px 4px;background-color:#ff=
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] Ok guys and girls -- just who is telling the truth. David Farber (May 24)