nanog mailing list archives
Re: power to the internet
From: Dan Hollis <goemon () sasami anime net>
Date: Sat, 28 Dec 2019 11:47:25 -0800 (PST)
Nothing.It is extremely cheap, extremely durable, and nearly 100% recyclable. All the things lithium is not.
The only thing is lead acid is not power dense, but that is not generally a problem at sites.
-Dan On Sat, 28 Dec 2019, Baldur Norddahl wrote:
What is wrong with lead acid battery backup? Seems to be exceedingly stable from my experience. We have all our equipment on -48V DC and have never had a power interruption at any site. The requirements here are 48 hours of backup by law. Telecom is declared to be part of emergency and defense, so they put in a requirement for resilience. Regards Baldur tor. 26. dec. 2019 11.33 skrev Joe Maimon <jmaimon () jmaimon com>:Unless telecom infrastructure has been diligently changing out the lead acid battery approach at all their remote terminals, powered gpon, hfc and antennae plants will never last more than minutes. If at all. A traditional car has between a 100-200amp alternator @12volts How much generating capacity can you get out of a typical hybrid? Self-isolating and re-tieing inverters. Economic household ATS systems. Do those exist? Enough independent distributed capacity and now comes the ability to create grid islands. How might that look? Electric grid shortage is likely coming to NYC, courtesy of folk of certain political persuasion and their love of stone age era living. IP decommissioning. If you have CO loop copper, keep it. Joe Don Gould wrote:This is a very short term problem. The market is going to fill with battery storage sooner rather than later. Solar is just exploding. Your car will "house tie". 6G will solve your data problem. D -- Don Gould 5 Cargill Place Richmond Christchurch, New Zealand Mobile/Telegram: + 64 21 114 0699 www. <http://www.tusker.net.au/>bowenvale.co.nz -------- Original message -------- From: Michael Thomas <mike () mtcc com> Date: 26/12/19 2:33 PM (GMT+12:00) To: nanog () nanog org Subject: power to the internethttps://www.politico.com/news/2019/12/25/california-power-shutoffs-089678This article details some of the issues with California's "new reality" of planned blackouts. One of the big things that came to light with these blackouts is that our network infrastructure's resilience is pretty lacking. While I was (surprisingly to me) ok with my DSL connection out in the boonies, lots and lots of people with cable weren't so lucky. And I'm not sure how bad the situation is with cellular infrastructure, but I assume it's not much better than cable. And I wouldn't doubt that other DSL deployments go dark when power is down. I have no clue with fiber. So I guess what I'm wondering is what can we do about this? What should we do about this? These days IP access is not just convenience, it's the way we go about our lives, just like electricity itself. At base, it seems to me that network operators should be required to keep the lights on in blackouts just like POTS operators do now. If I have power to light my modem or charge in my phone, I should be able to get onto the net. That seems like table stakes. One of the things we learned also is that the blackouts seem to last between 2-3 days apiece. I happen to have a generator since I'm out in the boonies and our power gets cut regularly because of snow, but not everyone has that luxury. I kind of want to think that my router+modem use about 20 watts, so powering it up would take about 1.5kwh for 3 days. a quick google look shows that I'd probably need to shell out $500 or so for a battery of that capacity, and that's doesn't include your phones, laptops, tv's, etc power needs. What does that mean? That is a major expense for a lot of people. On the bright side, I hear that power generator companies stocks have gone through the roof. On the dark side, this is probably coming to a lot more states and countries due to climate change. Australia. Sigh. Mike
Current thread:
- RE: power to the internet, (continued)
- RE: power to the internet Don Gould (Dec 25)
- Re: power to the internet Joe Maimon (Dec 26)
- Re: power to the internet Ben Cannon (Dec 26)
- Re: power to the internet Michael Thomas (Dec 26)
- RE: power to the internet Keith Medcalf (Dec 26)
- Re: power to the internet Howard Leadmon (Dec 30)
- Re: power to the internet John Lightfoot (Dec 30)
- Re: power to the internet Joe Maimon (Dec 26)
- Re: power to the internet Brandon Butterworth (Dec 26)
- Re: power to the internet Don Gould (Dec 26)
- RE: power to the internet Don Gould (Dec 25)
- Re: power to the internet Baldur Norddahl (Dec 28)
- Re: power to the internet Dan Hollis (Dec 28)
- Re: power to the internet Tom Beecher (Dec 28)
- Re: power to the internet Ben Cannon (Dec 28)
- Re: power to the internet Joe Maimon (Dec 28)
- Re: power to the internet Michael Thomas (Dec 26)
- Re: power to the internet Stephen Satchell (Dec 26)
- Re: power to the internet Michael Thomas (Dec 26)
- Re: power to the internet Constantine A. Murenin (Dec 26)