Penetration Testing mailing list archives
RE: SV: Honeypot detection and countermeasures
From: "Lampe, John W." <JWLAMPE () GAPAC com>
Date: Tue, 24 Jun 2003 12:20:42 -0400
If you lump LaBrea in with these honeypots (and I don't see why you wouldn't), then the check is trivial (in fact, NESSUS can optionally check for the existence of LaBrea prior to launching nmap...that's nice) some of the pricey honeypots (hi ManTrap) are trivial as well. And, when youve found some anomalous box on the network, it's always nifty to run a blackbox IP ID scanner against it (i.e. if the machine uses simple incrementing IP IDs, then record the ID every minute for a couple of days, then check back to see when the box traffic peaks...you might not find a honeypot, but you'll find lots of those reverse proxy / vpn thingees)
-----Original Message----- From: dave () immunitysec com [mailto:dave () immunitysec com] Sent: Tuesday, June 24, 2003 10:45 AM To: pen-test () securityfocus com Subject: Re: SV: Honeypot detection and countermeasures Well, that's a great way to think about it - as a test of your countermeasures. In fact, there are MANY ways to both remotely and locally detect various breeds of honeypots. VMWare, for example, uses a particular range of MAC addresses, among other things. I always find it funny when people use VMWare as a security measure. But (imho) it's a truly RARE penetration test team that will notice some of these subtle things, and basically no pentration test teams can remotely discover a honeypot - the technology for doing so just isn't public enough yet. (Well, I just gave away that MAC address trick, but it's limited to the local net, and there are lots of other, better tricks). Dave Aitel Immunity, Inc. http://www.immunitysec.com/But...the last thing, since that was commented (but wasremoved fromthe thread I'm answering on). If you hire a company to do apentest,of course you don't tell them about your countermessaures.The pentestis the exam for the system you have deployed, and the guysthat testsyou are the examiners. The result from the pentest should/might include that, yes, they found the honeypots, and it distracted them for some time before they understood what they had hit (ahoneypot isjust another countermeassure), and then the rest of thereport comes.If you want to pentest a new service, then of course point them at that service. If you want to pentest your company...thenthat's whatyou tell them. Regards, Trygve Aasheim Manager, Network Security -----Opprinnelig melding----- Fra: Rob Shein [mailto:shoten () starpower net] Sendt: 23. juni 2003 15:58 Til: 'Michael Boman'; 'Larry Colen' Kopi: 'Brass, Phil (ISS Atlanta)'; pen-test () securityfocus com Emne: RE: Honeypot detection and countermeasures This wouldn't work. Seeing the packets/traffic on the wire doesn't tell you the tools that are used, and it also doesn'treally give youmuch else. Considering that a honeypot is either not reallyrootable(DTK) or is very low hanging fruit (and very rootable, like a honeynet.org system), they either won't see tools downloaded to the system or won't see anything more than the bare minimum needed to exploit a system that is too vulnerable to begin with.-----Original Message----- From: Michael Boman [mailto:michael.boman () securecirt com] Sent: Wednesday, June 18, 2003 11:32 PM To: Larry Colen Cc: Brass, Phil (ISS Atlanta); pen-test () securityfocus com Subject: Re: Honeypot detection and countermeasures On Wed, 2003-06-18 at 10:15, Larry Colen wrote:Good point. I was more envisioning a scenario where theclient wastesting the whole security system, including the honeypots. I.e. hiring a pen-tester without giving the pen-tester anyknowldege of thesystem before hand. If I seem like a clueless newbie, I hope that I at leastseem like apolite clueless newbie. I'll crawl back into my hole andlurk a bitmore. LarryThere is a viable scenario for this. Let's say ACME Inc.wants to dotheir own pen-tests because they - Don't like to pay outsiders to do it - Want to compete with the company - They want to steal their tools and techniques - insert your own paranoid explanation for the "why" bit They hire a group of people to hack their systems and record everything so once the exercise is over ACME Inc. nowknows the toolsand techniques of that particular pen test group. It's unlikely, but possible. Haven't happen to me (yet). Best regards Michael Boman -- Michael Boman Security Architect, SecureCiRT Pte Ltd http://www.securecirt.com-------------------------------------------------------------- ------------- Latest attack techniques. You're a pen tester, but is google.com still your R&D team? Now you can get trustworthy commercial-grade exploits and the latest techniques from a world-class research group. Visit us at: www.coresecurity.com/promos/sf_ept1 or call 617-399-6980 -------------------------------------------------------------- --------------
--------------------------------------------------------------------------- Latest attack techniques. You're a pen tester, but is google.com still your R&D team? Now you can get trustworthy commercial-grade exploits and the latest techniques from a world-class research group. Visit us at: www.coresecurity.com/promos/sf_ept1 or call 617-399-6980 ----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Current thread:
- Re: Honeypot detection and countermeasures, (continued)
- Re: Honeypot detection and countermeasures Lance Spitzner (Jun 24)
- Re: Honeypot detection and countermeasures miguel . dilaj (Jun 18)
- Re: Honeypot detection and countermeasures Acl Proxy (Jun 19)
- SV: Honeypot detection and countermeasures Trygve Aasheim (Jun 24)
- Re: SV: Honeypot detection and countermeasures dave (Jun 24)
- RE: Honeypot detection and countermeasures Rob Shein (Jun 24)
- RE: Honeypot detection and countermeasures Michael Boman (Jun 24)
- RE: Honeypot detection and countermeasures Rob Shein (Jun 24)
- RE: Honeypot detection and countermeasures .:[ Death Star]:. (Jun 25)
- RE: Honeypot detection and countermeasures Bojan Zdrnja (Jun 25)
- RE: Honeypot detection and countermeasures Michael Boman (Jun 24)
- RE: SV: Honeypot detection and countermeasures Lampe, John W. (Jun 24)
- Re: Honeypot detection and countermeasures Gerardo Richarte (Jun 24)