FC: NAI was pursuing PGP copyright violations; Radiusnet replies

[Declan McCullagh <declan () well com>]

Previous Politech message:

"Network Associates thwaps PGP sites with DMCA nastystick"
http://www.politechbot.com/p-03565.html

Slashdot thread:
http://yro.slashdot.org/yro/02/05/22/0226246.shtml?tid=93

---

From: "Ed Carp" <erc () pobox com>
To: <declan () well com>
Subject: RE: FC: Network Associates thwaps PGP sites with DMCA nastystick
Date: Tue, 21 May 2002 23:29:47 -0500

You might have spoken too soon - apparently, the site in question was 
hosting commercial versions of NAI software, including PGPDisk
(see the Google cache of the directory in question at
http://www.google.ca/search?q=cache:2PdJtPM6n0QC:crypto.radiusnet.net/archive/pgp/+&hl=en). 
So, it appears this is a simple case of
copyright infringement, not NAI trying to get sites to remove previously 
'free' versions of software, unless you know differently.
--
Ed Carp, N7EKG          http://www.pobox.com/~erc               214/986-5870
Director, Software Development
Escapade Server-Side Scripting Engine Development Team
Pensacola - Dallas - London - Dresden
http://www.squishedmosquito.com

---

Date: Wed, 22 May 2002 14:41:59 +1000 (EST)
From: Grant Bayley <gbayley () ausmac net>
To: Declan McCullagh <declan () well com>, "R. A. Hettinga" <rah () shipwright com>,
        Meyer Wolfsheim <wolf () priori net>, <peter_beruk () nai com>
Subject: Re: NAI pulls out the DMCA stick.

Hi Declan, others.

The hype being generated by the "NAI pulls out the DMCA stick" postings
and the spectre of PGP being "removed from the Internet" is entirely
bogus, and provably so with a little bit of fact checking.

Looking through the Google cache, it becomes very clear very quickly that
crypto.radiusnet.net was hosting a copy of the commercial version of the
software - not a copy of the PGPi (aka freeware) version of the PGP
product.  Given that this is the case, NAI is well within their rights to
demand the removal of the files.

You can confirm this in the Google Cache, here:

http://216.239.33.100/search?q=cache:QA-H5VtPvP4C:crypto.radiusnet.net/archive/pgp/+&hl=en

Keep in mind that of the couple of crypto/security archives out there, the
radiusnet one is basically the "abortion" of the bunch.  It's
disorganised and out of date in so many places as to be dangerous.

By "crypto/security archives", I'm referring to Wiretapped
(www.wiretapped.net, which I operate), munitions.vipul.net, the zedz.net
archives (ftp://ftp.zedz.net/) and Packetstorm (www.packetstormsecurity.org).

If this is the straw that breaks the radiusnet camel's back, I for one
won't be complaining, if only because of the old and out of date material
on the site.  In the case of tools that perform a security function using
crypto (IPSec, ssh etc), being updated is critical, as a number of the
older versions of the software have contained serious security problems.

Grant

-------------------------------------------------------
Grant Bayley                         gbayley () ausmac net
-Admin @ AusMac Archive, Wiretapped.net, 2600 Australia
 www.ausmac.net   www.wiretapped.net   www.2600.org.au
-------------------------------------------------------

---

Date: Tue, 21 May 2002 21:45:49 -0700
Subject: Re: FC: Network Associates thwaps PGP sites with DMCA nastystick
From: Chuck Koleczek <chuck () koleczek com>
To: <declan () well com>
CC: <rah () shipwright com>, <wolf () priori net>, Tess Koleczek <tess () well com>

Declan,

I hope you will follow up this Politech posting with more detail about what
software radiusnet.net was hosting.  I usually don't delve into the
discussion area of Slashdot, but I did in this case hoping to discover what
specific PGP software NAI was asking be delinked.  If it was the commercial
versions of PGP that disallowed redistribution then this is a reasonable and
legal request.  If this was a demand for delinking softwares that contained
provisions for redistribution within their licensing agreements then Mr.
Wolfsheim's insinuation of ulterior motives gains merit.

It is a good thing that Politech exists as a bridge between narrow forums
like cypherpunks and the grossly popular Slashdot.  Certainly the
discontinuation of PGP in this day and age "smells funny" to anyone paying
attention, and this issue deserves the facts to be aired.  I worry that when
the accessibility of personal encryption is truly compromised on the third
cry of "Wolf!" many who care will be caught not paying attention.

---

Date: Tue, 21 May 2002 19:23:12 -0400 (EDT)
From: audit <audit () radiusnet net>
To: Declan McCullagh <declan () well com>
cc: staff () radiusnet net
Subject: Re: Network Associates thwaps PGP sites with DMCA nastystick
Organization: Radiusnet.net - http://www.radiusnet.net

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----

Yea it really sucks that we had to pull that section down because that's
something that generated a lot of traffic. 10-1 they don't go after a lot
of the other sites that host PGP as I've seen sites still offering it.
Either they are ignoring it or just chose to handle it differently then
us. Either way, we're working on making things stonger and better in the
weeks to come and will come out of this just as good as before.

Thanks for the support as sometimes we need it to get through times like
this.

audit

Radiusnet Staff



On Tue, 21 May 2002, Declan McCullagh wrote:

>>
>>---
>>
>>Date: Tue, 21 May 2002 18:45:40 -0400
>>From: "R. A. Hettinga" <rah () shipwright com>
>>Subject: NAI pulls out the DMCA stick
>>Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>>X-UIDL: c8be0773ad05c53f938aa1b7b085a9cd
>>
>>--- begin forwarded text
>>
>>Date: Tue, 21 May 2002 15:03:42 -0700 (PDT)
>>From: Meyer Wolfsheim <wolf () priori net>
>>To: <cypherpunks () lne com>
>>Subject:  NAI pulls out the DMCA stick
>>
>>NAI is now taking steps to remove the remaining copies of PGP from the
>>Internet, not long after announcing that the company will not release its
>>fully completed Mac OS X and Windows XP versions, and will no longer sell
>>any copies of its PGP software.
>>
>>Do we still believe this was a pure cost-cutting measure?
>>
>>
>>From: http://crypto.radiusnet.net/archive/pgp/index.html
>>
>>================================================
>>
>>Date: Thu, 9 May 2002 13:01:40 -0500
>>From: Peter_Beruk () NAI com
>>To: root () radiusnet net, webmaster () radiusnet net
>>Subject: Network Associates, Inc. DMCA Notice
>>
>>     [ The following text is in the "iso-8859-1" character set. ]
>>     [ Your display is set for the "US-ASCII" character set.  ]
>>     [ Some characters may be displayed incorrectly. ]
>>
>>DMCA NOTICE OF INFRINGING MATERIAL
>>
>>Via Email:  root () radiusnet net; webmaster () radiusnet net;
>>         Re:     Digital Millennium Copyright Act Notice
>>Dear Radiusnet.net
>>I am writing on behalf of Networks Associates, Inc. and its affiliated
>>companies (collectively, "Network Associates").  As you may know, Network
>>Associates is a leading provider of computer software for network security
>>and management.  Among its business units are such well-known names as
>>McAfee, PGP Security, Sniffer Technologies, and Magic Solutions.
>>We have learned that Radiusnet.Net is providing access on its system or
>>network to material that infringes the copyrighted work of Network
>>Associates.  In particular, I refer you to the web pages located at
>>http://crypto.radiusnet.net/archive/pgp which contains links from your site
>>that provide unauthorized copies of NAI proprietary materials, including
>>software.  The material on this web site infringes Network Associates'
>>valuable copyrights.
>>Accordingly, Network Associates requests that Radiusnet.Net immediately
>>remove or disable access to this infringing material. You should know that
>>Network Associates takes its intellectual property rights seriously.  By
>>bringing this matter to your attention, we hope that Radiusnet.Net will act
>>promptly to remedy this problem.
>>We have a good faith belief that use of the material described above is not
>>authorized by Network Associates, any of its agents, or the law.   To the
>>best of our knowledge, the information contained in this notification is
>>accurate.
>>Under penalty of perjury, I am authorized to act on behalf of Network
>>Associates.  If you have any questions or concerns, please contact me at the
>>address listed above.  You can also reach me by e-mail at
>>peter_beruk () nai com or by phone at +1 301-947-7150.
>>Thank you for your anticipated cooperation.
>>                                         Sincerely,
>>
>>
>>                                         Peter Beruk
>>                                         Director, Anti-Piracy Programs
>>
>>Peter Beruk
>>Director, Anti-Piracy Programs
>>Network Associates, Inc.
>>Phone:  +1.301.947.7150
>>Fax:  +1.301.527.0482
>>
>>--- end forwarded text
>>
>>
>>--
>>-----------------
>>R. A. Hettinga <mailto: rah () ibuc com>
>>The Internet Bearer Underwriting Corporation <http://www.ibuc.com/>
>>44 Farquhar Street, Boston, MA 02131 USA
>>"... however it may deserve respect for its usefulness and antiquity,
>>[predicting the end of the world] has not been found agreeable to
>>experience." -- Edward Gibbon, 'Decline and Fall of the Roman Empire'
>>

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
Version: 2.6.3ia
Charset: noconv
Comment: http://www.radiusnet.net

iQCVAwUBPOrW5KyzESGmHGLJAQGflQP/f+GGvjfn7OUz/FwrDR7hcEAu6LrmyCcA
jxhX5T49sjaeOThjCIhKkMs5/br7Mo/fMN77vXluTK4DsW/ojK48jFhYlwL7sFev
S6hBaxhdcs7gG4eOMipiBzxk5Plx2L/WsIgYJAwWSx7Wu2tKDewLRYyIodkFghtT
Q7cVxaUHjds=
=RybN
-----END PGP SIGNATURE-----




-------------------------------------------------------------------------
POLITECH -- Declan McCullagh's politics and technology mailing list
You may redistribute this message freely if you include this notice.
To subscribe to Politech: http://www.politechbot.com/info/subscribe.html
This message is archived at http://www.politechbot.com/
Declan McCullagh's photographs are at http://www.mccullagh.org/
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
Like Politech? Make a donation here: http://www.politechbot.com/donate/
-------------------------------------------------------------------------