Re: Can Dave be cloned?

[Michael Murray <mmurray () episteme ca>]

David (and all),

I went through this exact same issue when I opened a new office for our vuln
research group, and found only one (somewhat frightening) answer: you have
to put in the work.  To find a handful of really strong people who could put
up with the intensity of our schedule and tasks (requiring pretty much the
same set of qualifications you have), we went through around 700 resumes,
and over 200 really intense interviews (including more than a few Java and
MCSE experts... ;) 

Ross Perot had a great quote about hiring strong people: "eagles don't flock
together.  You have to find them one at a time."

While it may seem extreme to do that many interviews, it was worth every
minute of it.  We also managed to strike a good mix of experienced engineers
and more than a few of the 'potentials' that others were talking about.

On the topic of potential: if I have to choose, I'll take an insatiable
curiosity and an ability to soak up new knowledge like a sponge over formal
a CS education any day.  You can teach somebody to code.  You can't teach
somebody to WANT to code.

-M

On 10/5/04 4:17 PM, "David Stein" <david.r.stein () gmail com> wrote:

> Desperately seeking Dave...
>
> I need to find one or more smart computer security hackers.  People
> who do research, but have some idea what goes on in the real world.
> People who write excellent software (especially in Python or Perl) but
> who are not merely software developers.  People who can do software
> engineering in both the forward and reverse directions.  People who
> can make new discoveries without having their hands held.  People who
> are frighteningly intelligent.  People, in short, a lot like Dave
> (well, the arrogance is optional).
>
> Do such people come out of school anymore?  Can anyone suggest a good
> way to look for them?  I've found a number of ways (starting with my
> corporate HR department) to get deluged by piles of resumes for MCSE's
> and computer rackstackers and Java ("The COBOL of the 21st Century
> (TM)") programmers, but I can't seem to find any true hackers.  It
> seems like the species is extinct.
>
> The degree of difficulty is increased because I'm looking for someone
> who has to be a US citizen.  It seems like a lot (maybe most) of the
> best work is being done outside the US these days.  From what I can
> tell the brightest US college students aren't interested in computers
> any longer.
>
> Anyone have any suggestions?
>
> Thanks,
> --
> David Stein
> david.r.stein () gmail com
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