funsec mailing list archives

Re: OK, here's a risk analysis question for you ...


From: Jeffrey Walton <noloader () gmail com>
Date: Mon, 17 May 2010 11:50:50 -0400

       "The answer is no to that," a BP spokesman, Tom Mueller, said
       on Saturday. "We're not going to take any extra efforts now to
       calculate flow there at this point. It's not relevant to the
       response effort, and it might even detract from the response
       effort."
Not to mention the harm it will cause BP when it comes time for the
civil and criminal suits. It sounds like BP is vastly under-reporting
the rate of flow. Perhaps, in part, due to Department of Justice
lawyers: "Attorney General Eric Holder said on Friday he was
dispatching a team of lawyers to New Orleans to monitor the oil spill
and that the Obama administration would vigorously enforce
environmental laws."
(http://www.reuters.com/article/idUSTRE63T42P20100430).

Exxon played the US court system in the Valdez eco-disaster. It will
be interesting to see if BP can match Exxon's 'judicial gamesmanship'.
I imagine BP has already begun to bribe members of the US Congress, or
increasing the amount of the bribes (err, 'PAC contributions'), in
preparation for future preceedings.

On Mon, May 17, 2010 at 6:11 AM, Rich Kulawiec <rsk () gsp org> wrote:
On Fri, May 14, 2010 at 08:35:58PM -0400, Dan Kaminsky wrote:
Anyway, the best estimates I've seen came from a random Slashdot post, which
actually cited some checkable mathematics (
http://slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=1651510&cid=32201876):

I checked it, and while I'm able to reproduce the calculation, I'm not
able to reproduce the numbers: my results are an order of magnitude and
change larger.  There could be any number of reasons for that: I might
have botched the math, or a units conversion, or chosen significantly
unrealistic values for some of the other parameters required (like
viscosity or fluid velocity).  Or my fluid mechanics may be rustier
than I thought.

But that's, I think, just one more reason why we should be dispensing
with all these estimates in favor of a direct measurement: the Pitot tube
method should yield a value for total fluid discharge accurate to better
than 1%.  However:

       BP has resisted entreaties from scientists that they be allowed
       to use sophisticated instruments at the ocean floor that would
       give a far more accurate picture of how much oil is really
       gushing from the well.

       "The answer is no to that," a BP spokesman, Tom Mueller, said
       on Saturday. "We're not going to take any extra efforts now to
       calculate flow there at this point. It's not relevant to the
       response effort, and it might even detract from the response
       effort."

Source:

       Giant Plumes of Oil Forming Under the Gulf
       http://www.nytimes.com/2010/05/16/us/16oil.html?hp


Yes, as I'm sure we'll all well aware, one of the last things anyone
should want to do when tackling an engineering problem is to have a
reasonably accurate idea of its size.

---Rsk
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