more on Your people are growing increasingly worried about a 'police state.' For such an educated audience,

[David Farber <dave () farber net>]

Begin forwarded message:

From: Wulf Losee <qx49 () comcast net>
Date: August 5, 2004 8:53:02 PM EDT
To: dave () farber net
Cc: NMunro () nationaljournal com
Subject: Re: [IP] Your people are growing increasingly worried about a 
'police state.' For such an educated audience,

Dave:
I don't know if Neil has ever traveled in police states, but I have -- 
and, although the US has a long way to go, it's starting feel like 
one's I remember traveling in.

For instance:
1. Now we have to show our IDs to travel by airplane. And I understand, 
that we will soon be forced to show our IDs when traveling on trains 
and busses. How is this any different from the former Soviet Union or 
China (before the current "liberal" government) where one had to show 
one's internal passport to travel?

2. American Citizens are being detained (and possibly tortured) without 
due process (in Cuba of all places!). How is this different from a 
police state?

3. Protestors are not allowed anywhere near the President during his 
public appearances. Hell, Democrats aren't allowed near the President 
during public appearances! To me it sounds like an African kleptocracy, 
where the President-for-Life is insulated from the opinions of his 
subjects.

4. The current administration is choosing it's scientific advisors 
based on political correctness, instead of academic credentials. Hmmm. 
Sounds like Lysenkoism to me. The spirit of Trofim Denisovich lives on.

5. The political climate is such that supporters of the current 
administration feel that they can, without shame, shout down opponents 
and dissenters as "traitors" (Sean Hannity's writings comes to mind). 
This is an administration supported by true believers.

6. The latest Patriot Act would make wiretapping and surveillance of US 
citizen's possible without a court order (if I understand it 
correctly). How is this any different in spirit from the behavior of 
East Germany?

Frankly, I had mixed thoughts about sending this email out. I worried 
that it would call attention to myself, and that I would receive a 
visit from the authorities. But then I remember that one of my 
ancestors died on Lexington Commons, 229 years ago, fighting for the 
liberty of his people and his country, and I can only feel ashamed that 
I had any second thoughts about posting this broadside.

--Wulf


At 01:36 PM 8/5/04 -0400, you wrote:

> ___
>
> Dave Farber  +1 412 726 9889
>
>
>
> ...... Forwarded Message .......
> From: "Munro, Neil" <NMunro () nationaljournal com>
> To: dave () farber net
> Date: Thu, 05 Aug 2004 11:45:58 -0400
> Subj: Your people are growing increasingly worried about a 'police 
> state.'
> For such an educated audience,
>
>
>
>         they seem to lack any sense of proportion, a sense of history 
> or an
> awareness of human nature.
>
> It's not as if real police states don't exist still; One can fly to 
> Cuba
> quite easily, or to Iran with some difficulty, or even defect to Saudi
> Arabia and North Korea. The intrusiveness of their governments, their
> indifference to public opinion, their brutality and ruthlessness, are 
> the
> hallmarks of a real police state.
>
> In the US, we are merely enjoying growing inconvenience and annoyance 
> amid
> the perpetual pull and push demanded by our simultaneous desires for
> personal autonomy and public safety. This balance will shift back and 
> forth
> as the public and the elites argue over its costs and benefits. Of 
> course
> there will be abuses; The right will complain about too-strict gun 
> laws,
> property seizures and judicial-indifference to politics' 
> property-grabs,
> while the left will complain about public stigma of new lifestyles, of
> legislative curbs on personal autonomy, and of expanded police-powers.
>
> But there is no chance that that we will have a police state, even if 
> Bush
> is reelected into perpetuity. The claim is so ludicrous that it is not
> worth a counter, but parody.
> John Ashcroft thinks you are important enough for him to read your 
> diary!
> The Christian Conservatives have hypnotized the Supreme Court! Tom 
> Delay is
> asking you to buy a gun!
> The horror.
>
> Not just parody, but also contempt. Millions of people have died from
> police-states over the last 90 years. The communists killed roughly 95
> million. The Nazi's destroyed another 50 million. The Japanese 
> militarists
> destroyed at least 30 million. North Korea recently starved one 
> million of
> its own people to death rather than admit internal failure.
> Arab autocracies - led by Saddam -- can surely claim to have killed a
> million or three. If you want proof, grab a spade and a plane ticket.
> And we claim we're living in a police state because of intrusive 
> luggage
> searches?  Popular anti-drug laws? A religious Attorney General? The
> embarrassment of discovering that a bureaucrat knows you read Noam 
> Chomsky?
> That some tens of people will get jailed for terrorist-plots they did 
> not
> join?
> Public safety will inevitably generate errors and burdens, some of 
> which
> are avoidable, and all of which should be minimized. In some 
> controversies,
> the ACLU will be correct. In others, the police and Ashcroft will have 
> the
> public and the law on their side.
> But surely the many people who lived and died in real police-states 
> should,
> would and do object to our wrapping ourselves in their terror and 
> deaths
> for our own ends.
>
>         Neil
>         (speaking personally, of course)
>
>
>
>
>
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