re This Is Why People Hate the Phone Company, AT&T

[Dave Farber <dave () farber net>]

Begin forwarded message:

> From: "Faulhaber, Gerald" <faulhabe () wharton upenn edu>
> Date: March 28, 2010 3:07:52 PM EDT
> To: Dave Farber <dave () farber net>
> Subject: RE: [IP] re  This Is Why People Hate the Phone Company, AT&T

> Both Ou and Spiegel are correct and both wrong.  But Ou did not say  
> “Gross Profit Margin”; he said “profit margin”.  What he  
> should have said was “return on invested capital”, which is in  
> the range he mentioned.  Gross profit margin is Revenues minus “cost 
>  of goods sold” (operating expenses) and does not include any taxes  
> or cost of capital.  It is a fairly meaningless number in a capital- 
> intensive industry.  So Spiegel is correct in stating GPR, but that’ 
> s not precisely what Ou said, and Ou sort of said the wrong thing an 
> yway.
>
>
>
> See, this is what happens when you let techies interpret economic  
> data;-)
>
>
>
> Professor Emeritus Gerald Faulhaber
>
> Business and Public Policy Dept.
>
> Wharton School, University of Pennsylvania
>
> Philadelphia, PA 19104
>
> Professor Emeritus of Law
>
> University of Pennsylvania
>
>
>
> From: Dave Farber [mailto:farber () gmail com] On Behalf Of Dave Farber
> Sent: Sunday, March 28, 2010 2:08 PM
> To: Faulhaber, Gerald
> Subject: Fwd: [IP] re This Is Why People Hate the Phone Company, AT&T
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Begin forwarded message:
>
> From: Dana Spiegel <dana () nycwireless net>
> Date: March 28, 2010 1:03:19 PM EDT
> To: Dave Farber <dave () farber net>, ip <ip () v2 listbox com>
> Cc: george_ou () lanarchitect net
> Subject: Re: [IP] re  This Is Why People Hate the Phone Company, AT&T
>
> Just to correct a statement that George Ou made: the 4 major  
> wireless telco's in the US have Gross Profit Margins around or above  
> 50% (not 6-10% as he states):
>
>
>
> Deutsche Telecom (includes all parent company operations as well as  
> USA's T-mobile) - Gross Profit Margin: 65.4%
>
> http://finapps.forbes.com/finapps/jsp/finance/compinfo/Ratios.jsp?tkr=dt
>
>
>
> AT&T (wireline and wireless) - Gross Profit Margin: 59%
>
> http://finapps.forbes.com/finapps/jsp/finance/compinfo/Ratios.jsp? 
> tkr=t
>
>
>
> Verizon (wireline and wireless) - Gross Profit Margin: 58.9%
>
> http://finapps.forbes.com/finapps/jsp/finance/compinfo/Ratios.jsp?tkr=vz
>
>
>
> Sprint Nextel - Gross Profit Margin: 49.1%
>
> http://finapps.forbes.com/finapps/jsp/finance/compinfo/Ratios.jsp? 
> tkr=s
>
>
>
> Also, AT&T had total 2009 revenues of >$123B, which makes their $17B  
> wireless 3G infrastructure about 13.8% of their revenue. Certainly  
> not a small amount, but given the number of complaints and their  
> gross profit margins, perhaps it seems too little (as in just enough  
> to make a claim that they are "upgrading").
>
>
>
> I agree that we should be sticking to the facts, but I think the  
> "hate" comes from a lot of different practices that were performed  
> by AT&T (and the companies that it has acquired over the years),  
> many (possibly most, depending on how you count) of which have not  
> been in the interest of their customers. AT&T was also the 3rd  
> largest national campaign donor ($5.4M), and both Verizon and AT&T  
> are among the top 20 lobbyist spending organizations in the US in  
> 2009 ($17.8M and $14.7M, respectively). All of this is not  
> surprising, given the size of the companies.
>
>
>
> http://www.opensecrets.org/orgs/list_stfed.php?order=A
>
> http://www.opensecrets.org/lobby/top.php?showYear=2009&indexType=s
>
>
>
>
> --
>
> Dana Spiegel
> Executive Director, NYCwireless
> dana () nycwireless net
> +1 917 402 0422
>
> -------------------
>
> NYCwireless is a non-profit organization that advocates for, and  
> enables the growth of free, public wireless networks
>
> -------------------
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> On Mar 28, 2010, at 12:22 PM, Dave Farber wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Begin forwarded message:
>
> From: George Ou <george_ou () lanarchitect net>
> Date: March 27, 2010 3:08:25 AM EDT
> To: 'Lauren Weinstein' <lauren () vortex com>, nnsquad () nnsquad org
> Cc: 'Richard Bennett' <richard () bennett com>, 'Brett Glass' <brett () lariat net 
> >, 'Dave Farber' <dave () farber net>
> Subject: RE: [ NNSquad ]  This Is Why People Hate the Phone Company,  
> AT&T
>
> So this is the extent of debate on telecom policy?  It all boils  
> down to "HATE THE TELCOS".
>
>
>
> "One of  those  carriers who aren't sitting on an iPhone monopoly  
> and praying that the 3G network doesn't completely crumble before 4G  
> is ready (you have been investing in 4G, right? You sure as hell  
> aren't spending anything keeping 3G awesome),"
>
>
>
> Really?  $17B in 2009 that AT&T spent on wireless 3G infrastructure  
> going onto $19B in 2010.  Let's not let the facts get in the way of  
> our "HATE".
>
>
>
>
>
> Damn these EVIL Telcos with 6% to 10% profit margins and over a  
> million employees.  They all need to be good like Google and the  
> other dotcoms and be more stingy about capex and job creation so  
> that they can have 20% profit margins.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> George Ou
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nnsquad-bounces+george_ou=lanarchitect.net () nnsquad org  
> [mailto:nnsquad-bounces+george_ou=lanarchitect.net () nnsquad org] On  
> Behalf Of Lauren Weinstein
> Sent: Friday, March 26, 2010 8:24 PM
> To: nnsquad () nnsquad org
> Subject: [ NNSquad ] This Is Why People Hate the Phone Company, AT&T
>
>
>
>
>
> This Is Why People Hate the Phone Company, AT&T
>
>
>
> http://bit.ly/95hnW8  (Tested)
>
>
>
> --Lauren--
>
> NNSquad Moderator
>
> Archives



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