funsec mailing list archives
Re: Student arrested over Counter Strike map
From: John Forrister <John () segfault com>
Date: Fri, 04 May 2007 20:54:38 -0700
Brian Loe wrote:
On 5/4/07, John Forrister <John () segfault com> wrote: <SNIP>The same is true of a hammer, a fork, or a pen.You had me going for a minute...
Heh. That was mostly a dig @ the previous messages, trying to point out how ridiculous banning 'weapons' can be.
Now, on to airplanes specifically: Regardless of the intent of the person with a given object, there are a lot of legitimate reasons to ban explosives, firearms, pepper spray, etc from airplanes (and, in some cases, the public at large).This is buying into exactly what may be to blame for all of those kids getting killed at VT. Its the difference between the kids who had opportunity to act and the old Holocaust survivor who acted - and gave his life. While its obvious to anyone with a brain why explosives provide no benefit to anything good on a plane, I - and I'm sure millions of others - are absolutely lost looking for a reason not to allow people carry firearms, pepper spray, knives, lighters, or a bottle of water onto an airplane.
Personally, I agree. The powers that be, however, don't. I'd actually like to see 'weapons free' zones banned in general, as all they do is scream 'soft target'. (Frankly, we're probably much closer on our philosophies to this than you realize).
Some of them have to do with malicious people. Others are simply safety concerns - the discharge of a firearm, whether intentional or accidental, on an airplane can have immediate, disastrous consequences for all involved.How so? You don't actually believe the Hollywood shtick that a simple bullet will tear out a massive hole in the fuselage of a plane do you?
Not at all. Explosive decompression would require a reasonably large explosion to initiate (to the best of my knowledge). I'd be somewhat concerned about a round penetrating a bulk head and hitting, eg, a pilot. Mostly I'd be worried about some twitchy yahoo who didn't know how to use his weapon hitting someone besides themselves on accident. Especially with the tendency being for people to see 'suspicious activity' everywhere they look.
Same for a can of pepper spray, or the rupture and ignition of an oxygen cylinder required by a passenger for medical reasons.Yep, you watch too much television.
Actually, I don't watch that much television. I have, however, personally seen what happens when a canister of compressed oxygen gets set on fire, and it's not pretty (though it is pretty impressive). The truck carrying the cylinders was completely destroyed (the frame itself was melted, among other things, and the cylinders themselves were launched quite some distance from the truck, and a good sized section of the asphalt underneath the truck had to be torn out and replaced (it's been a while, but I'd guess the area replaced was a good 15'x20'). The truck was delivering oxygen for medical use to the house of a friend of mine. In terms of pepper spray it was a while ago (and well before 9/11) that I was told this by airline personnel (yeah, I know, immediately suspect), but I can see where problems might arise if there's a shared air supply with the cockpit. The passengers can live with being uncomfortable for a while, but again, it'd be unfortunate for the pilots to be exposed to it during the flight. That said, I've carried pepper spray on a plane before (inadvertently - I forgot it was in my bag) and had no issues, but I didn't use it on anyone during the flight.
On another note, it's interesting (and kind of sad) that if he'd offered to sell the map for the game as a 'Training Simulation' to the local SWAT team instead of just playing it and owning a hammer, he could probably have made a bundle of money for his efforts, and not be in trouble right now.Name a single instance where the SWAT team entered a school before the killer had already finished killing his victims and himself? SWAT, police and sheriff departments have little use for such training tools - they simply need the forms to fill out and a pen, that's what they do in these situations...count the bodies, tell the parents. Not a job I would want for sure.
Not a job I'd want either, and I have a substantial amount of respect for those individuals who perform those jobs. Thing is, government buys a lot of stuff that'll never get used, and I'm sure you could sell this product to them. Valdis posted a link a bit ago towards a similar product. -John _______________________________________________ Fun and Misc security discussion for OT posts. https://linuxbox.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/funsec Note: funsec is a public and open mailing list.
Current thread:
- Re: Student arrested over Counter Strike map, (continued)
- Re: Student arrested over Counter Strike map Valdis . Kletnieks (May 05)
- Re: Student arrested over Counter Strike map Brian Loe (May 06)
- Re: Student arrested over Counter Strike map Valdis . Kletnieks (May 07)
- Re: Student arrested over Counter Strike map Drsolly (May 05)
- Re: Student arrested over Counter Strike map Paul Vixie (May 05)
- Re: Student arrested over Counter Strike map Brian Loe (May 05)
- Re: Student arrested over Counter Strike map Brian Loe (May 05)
- Re: Student arrested over Counter Strike map Drsolly (May 05)
- Re: Student arrested over Counter Strike map Brian Loe (May 05)
- Re: Student arrested over Counter Strike map Drsolly (May 05)
- Re: Student arrested over Counter Strike map John Forrister (May 04)
- Re: Student arrested over Counter Strike map Dennis Henderson (May 04)
- Re: Student arrested over Counter Strike map John Forrister (May 04)
- Re: Student arrested over Counter Strike map Valdis . Kletnieks (May 04)
- Re: Student arrested over Counter Strike map Brian Loe (May 05)
- RE: Student arrested over Counter Strike map Richard M. Smith (May 05)
- Re: Student arrested over Counter Strike map Brian Loe (May 05)
- Re: Student arrested over Counter Strike map Valdis . Kletnieks (May 21)
- Re: Student arrested over Counter Strike map Valdis . Kletnieks (May 04)