Re: Re: knife ban going to work?

["Brian Loe" <knobdy () gmail com>]

On 5/26/06, Drsolly <drsollyp () drsolly com> wrote:
> > It has nothing to do with what they were murdered with, but that they
> > were murdered for gang related business. Remove that from the
> > statistics and our murder rate is probably going to be
> > normal...regardless of weapon used.
>
> The trouble with removing "gang-related" murders from the statistics, is
> that you've chosen a bunch of murders to disregard, and I don't really see
> how you can decide to leave them out. Did you think that gangs are a
> purely US phenomenon?

Technically you CAN'T remove them, the data isn't stored that way.
However, one can propose that if drugs were legal, and gangs weren't
fighting over them, the would do less killing. These are business
killings. Its like including military kills in a murder rate, in my
book.

Further, you have the relationship between environment and violent
crime. You're not going to try and say your slums match ours are you?
Point is still, gun ownership is not related to murder rate.

> >
> > The UK - you keep happily dismissing - has the same number of
> > homicides with guns in 00/01 as it had in 1998. THAT gives evidence
> > that the murder rate isn't tied to gun ownership, does it not?
>
> I don't see how you deduce that.

I deduce that from seeing the number of homicides for the UK and Wales
dip from 95 levels and then start to climb back up again (it might not
have topped off yet!).

> What it says, is that we have a static
> murder rate.

No, its not static and its totally unaffected by the gun ban.

> And it's good that the US murder rate is falling, and I hope
> that it gets down to UK levels.

Yeah, it is good, and its happening without a gun ban!

What are you missing here - gun ownership is not related to murder
rates. At best, the ability of an individual to defend oneself with
the most appropriate tool may reduce violent crime.

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